All Small Six Dowel pin removal

[clochard68]

How do I get the dowel pin out of the camshaft? Or is itbetter to buy a new wedding ring and dowel pin for a new cam?

 

[B RON CO]

Hi, mine was not too tight. I just worked it out with a pair of dykes. Be careful how you store them so they are easy to find when you need them. Good luck

 

[drag-200stang]

If you have a dowel that will not come out and if you do not want to save the cam, drill a hole on the other side of the cam and push it out, may damage dowel. Put a thin piece of metal against the spacer so it does not get dinged up.

 

[clochard68]

Thanks for the tip, I tried it but my pin is so tight it gets destroyed by the dykes.

I will try to get the ring out, but I will have to get a new dowel pin.

Does anybody know what size the dowel pin is supposed to be?
It seems to be out of stock everywhere atm...

 

[drag-200stang]

It is not a standard size; I will check later today.

 

[clochard68]

I found a dowel pin with the following specifications:

Dowel Pin
Hardened and Ground
ANSI B18.8.2 1978
Material: Alloy Steel
Hardeness: 50 - 58 HRC
Ø 1/4 inch --> according to my measurements and rockauto this should be the right diameter
Length 3/8 inch --> maybe a little too long, I can shorten it


Would the material strength be sufficient to use?

The old dowel pin was so soft it got destroyed from my vice grip and dykes.

 

[chad]

destroyed is no problem @ a few cents cost. Best way.
I use vice-grips on tight ones. Have a storage for all 'bushings' &
throw samples in there. Some motors still on stands have a zip tie
w/bockplate pins, tranny locaters'n this dowel.

"...buy a 1) new wedding ring and 2) dowel pin for a new cam?..." Depends
/OR/
1) No, only if destroyed/dammaged; 2) same.

 

[drag-200stang]

I get on a stock cam pin, length .316 - diameter .256 plus or minus .001 or so the, best I could measure. You can try the .250 pin but I think that it will be loose.
You know the pin is not super hard and it would be best to get the pin made for it. My fear is If the pin is too hard it may not conform to the hole and crack the cam.
Do you have a .250 drill bit. measure and test in clean hole.

 

[clochard68]

I get on a stock cam pin, length .316 - diameter .256 plus or minus .001 or so the, best I could measure. You can try the .250 pin but I think that it will be loose.
You know the pin is not super hard and it would be best to get the pin made for it. My fear is If the pin is too hard it may not conform to the hole and crack the cam.
Do you have a .250 drill bit. measure and test in clean hole.

I know a workshop that does only lathe work, so I could get one made very quickly tomorrow (that would beawesome because I want to get the engine done).

What kind of material would you suggest? Same as for a woodruff key probably?

I will visit my machine shop tomorrow, maybe they can help me out regarding material and manufacturing...

 

[drag-200stang]

I would try and get the right pin. My measurements may not be close enough, they were just a guide.
If you cannot get the right pin, maybe you could take your old pin and cam and have them measure and see if they can match the best they can.

 

[clochard68]

The old pin is deformed, I can only take measurements from the new cam and timing gear.
I ordered the dowel pin from vintageinlines, maybe I will get a response soon.

Either way I will make a trip to my machine shop and talk to them...

 

[clochard68]

I let my machine shop make a custom dowel on their lathe, because my cam and the double roller timing chain need different diameters.

How tight is the pin supposed to be in the camshaft? Is it an interference fit?
Iwould have guessed it should sit firmly and should be installed with a a few soft hits with a hammer? Or is that too tight?

 

[drag-200stang]

Yes, the pin is a just right interference fit.
I know a lot of people tap them in with a hammer, but a press method is the right way to do it and keep it straight.
Put bolt in it to strengthen the snout, vee block with aluminum pieces at contact points under the snout and carefully push it in making sure it is straight. I do not have an arbor press; I use a machinist vice that has nice straight flat aligned jaws.
Oh yea, do not forget the spacer on the right way- first. Do not ask why I know this.

 

[clochard68]

Yes, the pin is a just right interference fit.
I know a lot of people tap them in with a hammer, but a press method is the right way to do it and keep it straight.
Put bolt in it to strengthen the snout, vee block with aluminum pieces at contact points under the snout and carefully push it in making sure it is straight. I do not have an arbor press; I use a machinist vice that has nice straight flat aligned jaws.
Oh yea, do not forget the spacer on the right way- first. Do not ask why I know this.

I got the pin installed by pressing, it's a snug fit, and the timing gear fits and wedding ring is also installed
Camshaft endplay is within specs, finally I can start degreeing the cam!

Thanks everyone for the help!

 

[jaan-e]

So, what cam did you end up with?

 

[clochard68]

Hey Jaan,

I "played it safe" with my C4, stock converter and 2.79 rear gear combo and got the Isky Mile-A-More 321M camshaft, similar to a stock cam.

advertised duration: 248
duration at 0.050": 194
lift with 1.6 rockers: 0.415" (I have the RAU 1.65 rockers)
LSA: 108 (I talked with Isky, on their hompage it says LSA 109 but that is not true...)
overlap: 32

What's interesting is that the Isky cam basecircle is much smaller compared to my old stock cam...