Top-end and Cam Build

So the guilty party was the fuel pump. :banghead:

Lessons learned.....

So now I just need to figure out how to get this bad boy out. The bumper seems to be the problem. Not sure I can jack the engine high enough to clear it. I got scared of breakibg something and stopped. It's oh so close though.....
 
cr_bobcat":1a1uj3rj said:
I also noticed a lack of a crankshaft oil slinger. I'm assuming I should be finding one...
If you are going to use a adj. roller chain, they say it will not fit well,so just forget finding a slinger
It was more important when the road draft tube was used,blow by exited behind the the cam sprocket then out the side of the block,with it bringing more oil droplets to the front. It acted as a oil separator.
 
K. I figur if it wasn't there for 30+ years, and I never blew anything up, that it's probably OK. I am installing an adjustable, double roller set, so there is a pretty good chance that it won't fit under the timing cover anyway.

As far as the extraction saga goes, I've had to remove the front valance. I'm also going to have to completely remove the motor mounts so that I can drop the thing below the bumper. Bumper looked like a pain to remove and the mounts are all new HW as of last year. I'll pick the battle with the HW I trust to not fall apart....
 
Make sure you vacuum out the lifter galley, making sure the three drain back holes are clear and full size and they stay that way till the valve cover is on. ...... Or you may have oil control problems. If I am down to bare block I make them larger , carefully. New build will have vent ,tall riser at unused fuel pump boss.
 
drag-200stang":3hlyxoxh said:
Make sure you vacuum out the lifter galley, making sure the three drain back holes are clear and full size and they stay that way till the valve cover is on. ...... Or you may have oil control problems.

C "Arleen's" current posts under "Oil Pressure Frustrations". If she plumbs the PCV correctly & still has probs, the "open VC" look-see while running may show some 1 missed this very important step...
 
Cam is out. Cylinders and lifter channels have been vaccumed. Tomorrow I'm going to snag some carb cleaner to work the block deck and reduce the crud in the lifter valleys. Once that is flushed out I'll start installing the new cam. Need to order some prts tonight: timing cover gasket, t-stat gasket, and trans vac hard line.
 
for gasket surfaces use gasket remover instead, mr gasket makes an excellent product. carb cleaner can be used for the rest for the block cleaning.
 
RichCreations":16wm0xq4 said:
Econoline":16wm0xq4 said:
With the new seals I don't think it matters much from what I've read.
Well, it also spaces the balancer properly, I think you would want it...

Spaces it how? The balancer bolt will bottom out b/c the 18ga slinger is gone? I don't think so
 
Econoline":2mhn3cjx said:
RichCreations":2mhn3cjx said:
Econoline":2mhn3cjx said:
With the new seals I don't think it matters much from what I've read.
Well, it also spaces the balancer properly, I think you would want it...

Spaces it how? The balancer bolt will bottom out b/c the 18ga slinger is gone? I don't think so
not the bolt, but the balancer itself presses against the slinger, without the slinger, the groove on the balancer, and the water pump will be off the thickness of that 18ga piece of metal
 
RichCreations":1xw2kbdk said:
Econoline":1xw2kbdk said:
RichCreations":1xw2kbdk said:
Well, it also spaces the balancer properly, I think you would want it...

Spaces it how? The balancer bolt will bottom out b/c the 18ga slinger is gone? I don't think so
not the bolt, but the balancer itself presses against the slinger, without the slinger, the groove on the balancer, and the water pump will be off the thickness of that 18ga piece of metal

that amount of belt misalignment isnt enough to bother with. it might take ten miles off the life of the belt, at most.
 
Added some new pics. Block deck is all discolored but seems ok. I've done the gasket cleaner, run a razor over it, hit it and all lifter valley/piston with carb cleaner, then sprayed down with a coat of oil to prevent rust. Tomorrow I put in the cam.

Edit: copied in link

http://s1361.photobucket.com/user/cr_bobcat/library/Head Install

The pics of the block where the surface and cylinders look wet are the most recent and covered in oil
 
Gave the deck another 30min soak of gasket remover and scrape with the razor. She's looking better. I think I'll give it at least one more go tonight.

I did manage to pull the pin on the old cam and got the spacer moved over to the new one. Even though I got the old pin out, I decided to install the new one. Holding onto the old one just in case. It got a little boogered up by the vice grips. The new one was cheap so I figured why not.

For the new cam. The surfaces that mate to the bearings were taped to protect them. So I need to scrub them in order to remove any goo. Can I just use carb cleaner again? Is brake cleaner too harsh, because I have that as well?

On the cam, I did make a couple observations.
> The bearing surface at the #1 cylinder location appears to be wider than the old one. I interpret as "more stable.
> The distributor drive gear is noticeably smaller. I only compared because I remembered the CI website talking about this. I don't know it's an issue. Just an observation confirming the article. Here it is for reference: https://fordsix.com/archive/www.classicinlines.com/DizzyGear.html

My hopes/dreams/aspirations are that I can install this bad boy tomorrow. I have 1.5 bottles of Permatex assembly lube. I figure that ought to get me where I'm going for the cam, lifter-to-cam surface, and the new timing chain. I'll probably get a tube of assembly grease for the pushrods and valve tips.
 
If possible while the cam is out, can you get the crank clear of the cam and let us know what degree the crank has to be at.
It could help someone .
 
I never had that problem with my 250. Had the cam in and out way to many times to :cry:
 
Econoline":1xr6q38w said:
I never had that problem with my 250. Had the cam in and out way to many times to :cry:



The 250 cam is spaced out an extra two chain links at an angle. Although it has a 392 thou longer crank throw, the cam is spaced out a liile more than that. For sure, both the 250 and 200 engines are interferance engines, but a short deck 200 is more so.

The cam got reworked in the 170 versions for the later longer stoke Fords. On the 200, any variation fron stock con rod or cam machining or timing, wll result in expensive contact. Even timing chain stretch or a rod bolt can take out the whole cam and engine block on a 200 or 250 engine.


JackFish doesn't like it, but back half a dozen years ago, he bought a CS cam with incorrectly cast flanks.

This was the result.

JackFish":1xr6q38w said:
clunk01.jpg



viewtopic.php?t=65908

JackFish":1xr6q38w said:
Stock cam:
stockrelief01.jpg


Clay Smith:
4relief01.jpg

machined


The Ford 200 six has a problem in six areas


a) the cam to rod and oil pump clearnace area, and

b) needs the best timing chain and a stock profile cam casting or machining to clar the conrods.

c) when timed diffrently, cam to conrod contact is possiable

d) piston skirts. The 90 thou wrist pin offset, slotted skirt HSC piston is a risk as are all slotted skirt pistons. Ford has spent billons researching the rght bore hatching and plateu honing to ensure the oil, bore and piston suit the application. In the old days, sloted piston failue was common in L6 and I6 engines, and engineers would TIG weld the oil cntrol slots up to ensure piston survival. Skirt to recipricating part contact happens after a rod bolt or cam to conrod collision. Its a chicken and egg situation to find out which one happened first.


e) The results of oil drainback and sump inadequacies are that the engine suffers the typical hydraulic cam FE/Boss 302/ Cleveland 351 and 186/202 Holden empty sum syndrom at high rpm. Oil pressure shows up as okay, but the sump is emplty when the oil pump is madly suppling oil to the gallieries. These basic engines became hydraulic lifter engines, but the lifters then supplied too much oil in non hydraulic applications. In addequate drain back then ment a hard charging engine would have all its oil in the rocker cover, and none in the sump. The use of the wrong lifters, and the oil through pushords that the triple carb race 186 and 202 Holden Torana's used on Ford Sixes results in drain back issues. A guy could drown up there in a Ford rocker cover....FE 406, 427, Boss 302 and 351C engines in race environments just side oiled the engine to get drain back.

f) the harness of the distibutor and oil pump hex drive issues



Sump, piston, and cam degreeing becomes critical with the Ford six 200 and 250 more than any other engine.

See viewtopic.php?f=1&t=72474
 
I figure I must have gotten lucky, I was doing it on the stand as well which make things much easier anyway.
 
Cam is in. I did have some interference issues so I had to move the crank a bit. Ended up working once I got the crank key pointing almost straight up, a few degrees clockwise from 12 o'clock.

Just need to wait for a few supplies to arrive tomorrow and I should be right on my way :beer:
 
That adjustable double-roller timing chain sure does look purty in there. I have it set for 4* advance. I'll be setting up my high dollar degree wheel tonight to see where I land. I'm starting to get excited....

20160920_072936_zpslafampne.jpg


Pressing on it to see how much slack is in there. Nice and tight me thinks...
20160920_072946_zpsu53m9wao.jpg
 
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