Higher mpg and performance with a 223

Luke64

Luke64

Well-known member
In search of ways to maximize mpg while remaining period/original. Being a 64 223 it has the autolite carb. The original auto lite has no dashpot. I bought a new Amazon one (works good for cheap) and it has the dashpot. A few months back, while at a closing sale for a western auto, I acquired a free Holley carb for the earlier 223s. On the topic of mpg, is a step back in time better? I don’t see any idle adjustment on the Holley either. Is there jet options for lower rpm?

I hope to, this winter, make an intake for a dual carb set up. I’m unsure if I can make a good working carb out of my original autolite (they soldered the hole shut for the fuel bowl valve.) but if I can, will one carb not having a dashpot affect it? Or would it be better to run two of the earlier holleys?


High driving rpm is my main issue. Finding an r11 overdrive is nearly impossible. An r10 is more easily found. I think the main difference in bolt patterns is between brands. Are they model specific also for Ford?

I’m averaging about 12-14, at about 26-2800 rpm. If I could bring the rpm closer to 2000 I think those numbers could greatly improve.
 
There are several ways to maximize your MPG. Yes one of the Borg Warner Over Drive Transmissions would be about the best way to get there. The old timers used to claim that the Offy 2 X 1V Intakes (and several other old Brands like Fenton) would give better MPG than the stock single 1V Carb I believe that it should just by the better Fuel Distribution. Typically those would have a pair of the Holly 1904's, however if you had two good Autolites 1100 should be good also. Adding a Better Duel Advance type Distributor is another way, along with a good free flowing exhaust system and that's some of the external Mods that could be done, some more could be had by going inside the engine but that would get into more work and cost.
 
I do have the dual exhaust header from patriot, I’ve heard it won’t fit but I’ve yet to see. That will go on with the intake. I would love to have a pair of the Fenton dual exhaust manifolds with triple singles just for looks. Hens teeth. Offenhauser I might be able to find.
Eventually I have dreams of running a 262 crank and cam, get rid of the timing chain and have a stronger crank with a little more displacement. Make some custom rods and see how much fun we can have with a 223.

Currently with the single vacuum advance, pulling from the carb, I have vacuum at higher rpm. With the dual advance, I’ll have vacuum advance at lower rpm from the manifold, and mechanical up top, correct? What would you set base timing at? And do you have any suggestions for distributors?

Will I need a high pressure fuel pump with a regulator for dual carbs as well? Currently i have the stock low pressure with no return (no way to avoid vapor lock, altho it hasn’t happened yet)
 
Luke64 said:
I do have the dual exhaust header from patriot, I’ve heard it won’t fit but I’ve yet to see. That will go on with the intake. I would love to have a pair of the Fenton dual exhaust manifolds with triple singles just for looks. Hens teeth. Offenhauser I might be able to find.
Eventually I have dreams of running a 262 crank and cam, get rid of the timing chain and have a stronger crank with a little more displacement. Make some custom rods and see how much fun we can have with a 223.

Currently with the single vacuum advance, pulling from the carb, I have vacuum at higher rpm. With the dual advance, I’ll have vacuum advance at lower rpm from the manifold, and mechanical up top, correct? What would you set base timing at? And do you have any suggestions for distributors?

Will I need a high pressure fuel pump with a regulator for dual carbs as well? Currently i have the stock low pressure with no return (no way to avoid vapor lock, altho it hasn’t happened yet)
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I haven't had the chance to try out the Patriot Headers yet I had the Clifford's which also still has some available for the Pick Ups. If your Headers look like these in this listing I don't really see why they wouldn't fit though. They look to be very nicely made.
www.speedwaymotors.com

Patriot Exhaust H8425-B Full Length Header, 53-64 Ford Truck 223

Full-Length Header for Ford 223 6 Cyl (53-64). Full-length headers provide the ultimate performance for street rodders with high-performance engines. These header styles have longer primary tubes, which help produce more horsepower and torque than Tight Tucks. Chassis headers fit inside the...
www.speedwaymotors.com www.speedwaymotors.com

Yes those old stock Load O Matic Distributors are not the ideal for any type of Performance use is fairly easy to swap to a 300 Six Point or better yet an Electronic (DuraSpark II) Distributor there are some others also but I am not a Fan of the Budget HEI one's and in any case the Timing Curve will need to be redone to work well with a 215, 223, or 262's. Sometimes you can find an older used Mallery Duel Point Distributor these were only a Mechanical Advance and for that more old school look would do the job I had one for mine but its now getting harder to find them.

Yes the Offy’s are easy to get and many people don’t realize that Offy is still making them new so they see an old one and sometimes likely pay more than a new one costs. If you look at the Exeter Auto Parts Offenhauser Products Catalog on page 29 (see the below link) you will still find listings for brand new 1952 to 1956 223 Six Intake Manifolds in both the 2 X 1V Carb and 3 X 1V Carb Intakes and also the Early Polished Valve covers with the 2 Stud Mounting. Those intakes will also fit on the newer engines except for those that are the Cars that have a lower Hood Line starting with the 1957 year models than the Carbs are setting up too high; this isn’t a problem with any of year of the pickups. They also should have a Carb Linkage Kit for those Intakes I bought a new 2 X 1V Carb Intake and Linkage for my 1954 Customline about 12 or so years ago.


As for a better Timing Chain since the 215 & 223 Six uses the same Timing Chain and Gear set as the Ford Y Block V8's you could use one of the Rollmaster CS4060 Timing Chain Set's it's a strong Double Roller and is Multi Adjustable to degree your Camshaft fits the Ford Y Block 239 272 292 312 V8's. This below link has one of the lowest prices I have found. I had this exact same set years ago and it's absolutely well made and looks great too.

store.enginepartscenter.com

Ford 272/292/312 Y-Block (CS4060)

ROLLMASTER Ford Y-Block 272 292 312 BILLET Double Roller Timing Chain Set 9-key
store.enginepartscenter.com store.enginepartscenter.com

No you won't need any more Fuel Pressure than you what you have now these older Holley Autolite Carbs like the Webers don't really like it and sometimes the stock Mechanical Fuel Pumps will even need a Pressure Regulator. The Fuel return line is a good idea and there is a simple way to achieve that using a later style 3 port Fuel Filter if you should ever want to do that.
 
Very useful information bubba, thank you. I’ll have to call up that place, I’ve been unable to locate any so resorted to having to make one.
As for the low pressure fuel pump, I’m unsure how they fully work so forgive me, but if they don’t make enough pressure to push past the needle, where does the gas go inside of the pump? Or does it just work against itself? I’ve thought about plumbing a fitting into my filler neck or some other suitable location as a return, but didn’t think it would flow enough to return.

Does the extra strength of the 262 crank make up for the added stress of more stroke at higher rpm? About how many rpm is a 4 main motor good for?


Edit- yes those are the same headers I have, I can’t think of any reason either why they wouldn’t clear everything
 
I never broke a 223 Crankshaft even when racing them I did spin a Rod Bearing once that was on the early style 223's like the 1954 to 1959 or up to about a 1960. About 1961 Ford Redesigned and Improved the 223 Blocks and their Oiling System which yours would have making it a much better Short Block suited for Performance use. The 262's are not so easy to find have looked for one for many years now to build a Drag Race motor with. But yes if you can find one of the 262 Crankshaft's they are a Forged Steel unit and it will drop right into the 223 Block it would be a smaller Bore size than what a 262 has and a much longer Stroke might not like to rev up as fast as the 223's do. It would make some good bottom end Torque at a lower RPM though and would be good for pulling a trailer or hauling some heavy weight. The 262's have very strong Blocks compared to the 223's with much more Metal (around 20 to 30 Pounds) in them for extra Block Webbing and around the Mains the exterior lower sections for much more strength.
 
I wouldn’t say they’re super common around me, but I have seen a few before I really knew what they were. I’d love to get my hands on one. I know you can buy cranks and cams for them, but to build a whole 262 would be a good experience. What kind of racing did you do? That’s super cool! What kind of rpm would you/did you take a 223 to?
 

On the Vapor Lock I have use most of these methods over the years and they all will work. The main one I haven't used yet is the adapting of a Fuel Return Line on a Pre 1970's Car or Truck but I will be using it on my next build. The main causes of the Carb's Fuel heating up happens from Radiant and Convection Heat Transfer from the Engine's Block, Head, and the Exhaust Manifold since that will happen to mostly all the older Inlines because of them being on the same side as the Carb and Intake Manifold of these Inline Six's.​

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First thing I do on all my own older model cars and trucks to fight against Vapor Lock is hunt for and install a the thickest Factory type carb base gaskets these were commonly used on the early, mid, 1970's and up to early 1980's Ford emissions Cars and Trucks, you would need some longer Carb Studs also. Or if it's an even more suborn problem I then install a Bakelite spacer if I can find one, or a Phenolic spacer these can also be made, or a carb spacer could even be made out of wood some solid hardwood like maple or ash is good, or even some quality Plywood, or make one out of a section of Plastic Cutting board. You could insulate the fuel line to and or use some wooden Clothes Pins. Building a heat shield under the carburetor to shield it from the exhaust heat also helps and is also an insulator. You can sometimes get small sheets of phenolic material on ebay or at McMaster Carr.​

These Last older Posts All Talk about the same thing just using some of the different methods. ​


Here is a Post by long time site member “65coupei6” The easy way is to use a fuel filter with a return. Just plumb it in with a "T" back to the Fuel Pumps feed line. No need to go back to the tank. This worked for me for many years.

Long time site member “xctasy” Posted about The $8 Cure For Vapor Lock" is a 60 to 100 thou restrictor in the third return. So you can use 1/4 or 5/16 internal diameter hose to the filler neck on your gas tank, Does10s style.”

As I mentioned in the above post there is a way to use a Fuel Filter with 1 inlet and 2 outlets to make a return Fuel line back to the Fuel Pump Inlet or better yet back to the Fuel Tank the moving Fuel keeps the Carbs Fuel inside of the Bowl much cooler too. Also insulate any under hood fuel lines for the heat. See below attachment too on what these Fuel Filters look like. To me all of these are about the best way to go now along with using the above Insulator methods. Here is a little more info on how to do it.

On you above first post I wanted to let you know that your current Bell Housing can be Modded to be able to use one of the T5 Overdrive Transmissions out of the Ford 5.0 Mustang & Merc 5.0 Capri you can use up to the 1993 year models for a direct bolt in then and the 1994 &1995 T5's can also work if you swap in the 1993 down front input shaft. So those should be much easier to find then one of the old the Borg Warner 3 Speed OD R11 Transmissions.

I started Racing them back when I was 16 and still in High School I raced a 1956 F100 Short Bed Pick Up with the 223 and 3 Speed Trans with a 3.89 Rear Gear. I raced another car Model A Ford a little before that one these were at the local Drag Strip "Irwindale" close to my home in the SoCal area was a lot of fun for me even if I didn't have much money to work with, but I was hooked on racing and built and raced many others. I didn't have a Tach but my best guess was that I didn't Rev it more than about 5,500 RPM or so I could tell when the engine would stop pulling so that's when I shifted it, for what it was it was a fairly good runner and mostly a stock short block.

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Awhile back I believe we talked about vapor lock, I have a thicker Bakelite spacer I made also. the thin one is doing okay, I’m not sure I want to try pulling the studs on the manifold and replacing them with longer ones to run the longer spacer. My fuel pump doesn’t have a return, altho looking at the diagram and thinking on it more I suppose I could run two of those, just to try and circulate some fuel in the line. Run the two to eachother. But until I have a return to my tank I can’t fully utilize the vapor lock filter.

I had good luck as well with the three row champion radiator from jegs, it no longer overheats, starts up as soon as you touch the key in most cases. It’s only when it really sits for 15-20 minutes, long enough to heat everything up but not long enough to start cooling down. I’ve never fully vapor locked either, but the bucking symptoms do sound like air in my fuel line. I believe that would be percolating, in which case your insulation you suggested might be the full solution

The sounds of a 5 speed excite me, but I do like the column shift and boy is the price tag there. Less than an overdrive in some cases though. It might be a losing battle, it’s an old truck how much can I really ask.

5500 wow! That sounds like a hoot. In the next few years I’ll have to run the ol 64 down the 1/4. Hard to beat a screaming six. Did you continue to build six’s?
 
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Yes I do remember talking some with you about this before. To do the return Fuel / Vapor Line the easy way using only one would be needed of the Metered Orifice 3 port type Fuel / Vapor Filter Separator's. All you would need to do is remove the existing Fuel Outlet Line going up the Carb's Fuel Bowl down at the Fuel Pump (Fitting on your Fuel Pump Outlet Side) then install a T I am fairly sure those use a screw in Fitting that is a 1/8 NPT (US Pipe Thread). Something like this Street L Fitting installed in the Fuel Pump Outlet would be quick and easy then reinstall the Tubing Fitting on the straight end and install the Fuel Line going to the Carbs Fuel Bowl that should work good. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B074FSVDF3?th=1&psc=1&language=en_US

Then to hook up to the Return Line coming from the 3 Port Fuel Filter (the one with the Metered Orifice) this would run back down to the newly installed Fuel Pump Fitting. If you want to use a 1/4 Inch Rubber Fuel Hose use a Fitting like this one and a Stainless Steel Hose Clamp. https://www.amazon.com/Barb-Adapter-Barbed-Brass-Fitting/dp/B07SKVXK5K?th=1

If you wanted to use a 1/4 inch Metal Tubing use a fitting like this one. https://www.amazon.com/Parker-4MSC2N-B-Compression-Fitting-Adapter/dp/B000FMYGHQ/ref=sr_1_3?keywords=1/8"+NPT+Male+x+1/4"+Tubing+Brass+Fitting&s=hi&sr=1-3

Or if you would like to use 1/4 inch Brake Line you would need an Automotive type Fitting that's a 1/8 inch NPT (Male Thread) and a (Female Thread) 1/4 Inch Brake Line Tubing Fitting.

Yes I have had Six's most of my life as well as being heavy into the V8's for several years too. I had a 1954 Ford Customline 223 with a three Speed with Over Drive, a 1977 Maverick with a 250 Six and C4, and a 1994 F150 with a 300 Six and 5 Speed all at the same time up until about 2015. Currently I am building a Performance 200 Six for an early Mustang. I have also been looking for an early Falcon or Comet for quite awhile to build with a 200 and or a 250 Six) as well as a Pick Up in the range of form 1940 to 1996 in a Short Bed it would be Six powered. I also want to build another Race Car too and it will also be Six Powered too if everything happens to go well.
 
Granted, this is in a car with 3:55 rear and 14" tires...but I've been enjoying the hell out of my built 223 and the last several fill ups after I got the cruise and part throttle vacuum advance canister right, I've averaged 26-28mpg!! The other day I surprised a fart can tuner when I stood on first struggling to get any kind of traction and left marks hitting second standing on the 5500rpm redline...haha its such a fun little engine now!

@bubba22349 check out the cranking compression now! 😈
 

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Galaxieinline, I believe I’ve seen your videos on YouTube, great sounding 6! And great numbers too! Currently I’m running 3.90 gears close to 3k on the tach at true 60, my Speedo is slightly off. Do you have an overdrive? Those numbers are amazing
 
Wow GalaxieInline, that's some great Cranking Compression NOW! I can only imagine how much fun your having with it.
 
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